Transcript Highlights:

• There are just two states that have put in place delivery fees: Colorado back in 2021 and then Minnesota
• There are just two states that have put in place delivery fees, Colorado back in 2021 and then Minnesota

Committee: House Transportation

Summary: The Assembly Transportation Committee first took up three highway memorial naming resolutions on its consent calendar: ACR 109, SCR 78, and SCR 90. The committee approved the consent calendar on an 11-0 vote, with the roll not held open. The chair also recognized committee science fellow AJ Mendeola for his service before adjourning the bill-hearing portion and moving to an informational hearing. The informational hearing focused on alternatives to the gas tax and how other states are responding to declining fuel-tax revenue. A first panel of researchers and policy experts described the erosion of gas-tax receipts due to inflation, improved fuel efficiency, and growth in electric vehicles, and compared options such as EV registration fees, kilowatt-hour charging fees, delivery fees, transportation network company fees, managed lanes, and road usage charges. Witnesses generally said road usage charges best preserve the user-pays principle, but they also emphasized that implementation costs, privacy concerns, and public understanding remain major obstacles. Committee members raised concerns about fairness for commuters, low-income drivers, and EV adoption, while some members argued a mileage-based system could amount to a new tax unless the gas tax is actually repealed. The second panel featured state officials from Hawaii, Utah, Oregon, and Virginia describing their programs. Hawaii said it launched its road usage charge program on July 1, 2025, using existing safety-check and registration systems, with EV owners initially choosing between a per-mile charge and a flat annual fee before mandatory EV participation begins in 2028 and a broader transition plan is due by 2026. Utah described its voluntary EV road usage charge program, annual flat fee option, quarterly reporting, privacy protections, and recent cost reductions as enrollment grows. Oregon began outlining its structural funding challenges and constitutional cost-responsibility framework, while the hearing overall underscored that states are experimenting with different approaches but have not settled on a single replacement for the gas tax.

Transcript Highlights:

• Senate Bill 132 in the statute of favor. Yes. Votes open to machines. Vote to machine.
• Currently in statute, lab schools can be created and run through their lab school districts or through
• The statute, though, names UL specifically and not the system, and there's a lab school in development

Bills: SR116 , SR117 , SR118 , SR119 , SCR68 , SCR69 , SCR12 , HB682 , HB766 , HB769 , HB775 , HB783 , HB824 , HB926 , HB1186 , HB1201 , HB1223 , HB1245 , HB1247 , HB1253 , HB1258 , HB221 , HCR53 , HCR62 , HCR72 , HCR58 , HB54 , HB137 , HB180 , HB192 , HB310 , HB321 , HB396 , HB512 , HB552 , HB578 , HB638 , HB663 , HB708 , HB717 , HB718 , HB1009 , HB1082 , HB1104 , HB1107 , HB1194 , HB1198 , HB1246 , HB1250 , SB29 , SB30 , SB32 , SB41 , SB42 , SB43 , SB47 , SB84 , SB93 , SB113 , SB192 , SB199 , SB219 , SB220 , SB221 , SB222 , SB241 , SB253 , SB255 , SB289 , SB292 , SB306 , SB314 , SB351 , SB399 , SB404 , SB14 , SB102 , SB133 , SB151 , SB165 , SB169 , SB170 , SB200 , SB217 , SB280 , SB291 , SB300 , SB303 , SB330 , SB449 , SB489 , SB521 , SB424 , SCR9 , SB25 , SB250 , SB348 , SB405 , SB444 , SB485 , SB35 , SB65 , SB132 , SB215 , SB246 , SB249 , SB269 , SB282 , SB296 , SB323 , SB363 , SB369 , SB474 , SB490 , SB492 , SB500 , HCR26 , HCR45 , HCR61 , HCR77 , HCR31 , HB649 , HB665 , HB681 , HB721 , HB746 , HB757 , HB781 , HB835 , HB844 , HB857 , HB872 , HB886 , HB889 , HB892 , HB982 , HB987 , HB1037 , HB1068 , HB1072 , HB1078 , HB1085 , HB1132 , HB1137 , HB1167 , HB1174 , HB1232 , HB1238 , HB23 , HB136 , HB17 , HB21 , HB51 , HB55 , HB74 , HB106 , HB108 , HB133 , HB140 , HB159 , HB168 , HB215 , HB226 , HB263 , HB296 , HB299 , HB322 , HB364 , HB519 , HB535 , HB538 , HB568 , HB571 , HB622 , HB635 , HB676 , HB772 , HB784 , HB1006 , HB1018 , HB1043 , HB1070 , HB1134 , HB1239 , HB62 , HB193 , HB203 , HB210 , HB220 , HB228 , HB246 , HB420 , HB475 , HB486 , HB574 , HB584 , HB750 , HB813 , HB815 , HB826 , HB870 , HB949 , HB953 , HB1045 , HB1092 , HB1151 , HB1162 , HB1176 , HB1177 , HB1196 , HB1214 , HB1241 , HB36 , HB73 , HB119 , HB126 , HB129 , HB166 , HB211 , HB245 , HB271 , HB280 , HB337 , HB351 , HB354 , HB399 , HB677 , HB712 , HB723 , HB726 , HB728 , HB759 , HB789 , HB850 , HB956 , HB966 , HB1036 , SB149 , SB382 , SB441 , HB258 , HB842

Keywords: SR116, Senate Resolution 116, Louisiana Senate, condolences, memorial resolution, tribute, Tyler Marie Grezaffi, law enforcement, corrections officer, deputy sheriff, master sergeant, investigator, Louisiana State Penitentiary, Pointe Coupee Parish, Iberville Parish, public service, bereavement, sympathy, SR117, Senate Resolution 117

Transcript Highlights:

• It's a statute, a federal statute? Thank you. Every Student Succeeds.
• It's a statute, a federal statute? Yes.
• A total of 26 income tax checkoffs are still in statute.
• I'll have to pull the revised statute up to see what... I'll look at it.
• I'll have to pull the revised statute up to see what...

Bills: SB524 , SR108 , SR109 , SCR56 , SCR57 , SCR12 , HB227 , HB398 , HB689 , HB897 , HB1029 , HB1107 , HB1217 , HB221 , HCR58 , HB136 , SB162 , SB382 , SCR33 , SCR30 , SB112 , SB194 , SB307 , SB341 , SB346 , SB363 , SB495 , SB503 , SB507 , SB509 , SB513 , SB408 , SB131 , SB145 , SB333 , SB464 , SB466 , SB500 , SB283 , SB338 , SB488 , SB35 , SB65 , SB215 , SB228 , SB246 , SB249 , SB268 , SB269 , SB282 , SB296 , SB312 , SB319 , SB323 , SB369 , SB431 , SB474 , SB484 , SB490 , SB492 , SB501 , HCR14 , HB537 , HB652 , HB653 , HB661 , HB726 , HB756 , HB851 , HB964 , HB966 , HB34 , HB35 , HB48 , HB474 , HB553 , HB758 , HB852 , HB10 , HB16 , HB36 , HB44 , HB46 , HB52 , HB61 , HB78 , HB98 , HB102 , HB124 , HB126 , HB131 , HB135 , HB141 , HB142 , HB164 , HB170 , HB171 , HB179 , HB194 , HB231 , HB245 , HB280 , HB292 , HB294 , HB297 , HB305 , HB336 , HB337 , HB351 , HB436 , HB594 , HB789 , HB956 , HB957 , HB995 , HB1040 , HB50 , HB117 , HB120 , HB122 , HB139 , HB148 , HB149 , HB185 , HB199 , HB247 , HB271 , HB286 , HB301 , HB358 , HB359 , HB384 , HB413 , HB428 , HB450 , HB462 , HB547 , HB613 , HB631 , HB657 , HB669 , HB675 , HB680 , HB691 , HB712 , HB716 , HB720 , HB723 , HB727 , HB728 , HB735 , HB747 , HB759 , HB825 , HB842 , HB845 , HB846 , HB903 , HB904 , HB907 , HB923 , HB929 , HB941 , HB962 , HB965 , HB1036 , HB287 , HB370 , HB515 , HB521 , HB570 , HB1200 , HB29 , HB39 , HB58 , HB67 , HB73 , HB76 , HB77 , HB82 , HB112 , HB121 , HB125 , HB132 , HB134 , HB151 , HB154 , HB155 , HB161 , HB166 , HB187 , HB191 , HB207 , HB211 , HB224 , HB238 , HB241 , HB242 , HB250 , HB260 , HB265 , HB275 , HB300 , HB320 , HB338 , HB339 , HB349 , HB379 , HB399 , HB427 , HB463 , HB464 , HB468 , HB545 , HB550 , HB551 , HB565 , HB588 , HB639 , HB725 , HB782 , HB805 , HB808 , HB834 , HB847 , HB853 , HB858 , HB861 , HB883 , HB916 , HB937 , HB977 , HB1012 , HB1027 , HB1044 , HB1054 , HB1071 , HB1091 , HB1117 , HB119 , HB129 , HB677 , HB850 , SB68 , SB149

Keywords: Jump Start, career and technical education, CTE, career diploma, career pathways, workforce development, high school diploma, career major, individual career and academic plan, ICAP, individual graduation plan, IGP, work-based learning, apprenticeship, internship, dual enrollment, articulation agreement, transfer credit, rural schools, rural LEA

Transcript Highlights:

• The statute is overbroad and does not detail any specific difficulty that courts aren't already dealing
• States like Minnesota and Colorado already prohibit sexual relationships between a provider and a former
• Statute also guides the policies that exist for police agencies that guide how officers are expected
• Lastly, this bill is clearly modeled on the statute at issue in Hill v. Colorado.
• I would argue reading 5D of the statute, it's not technically an enhancement.

Summary: The committee heard a long agenda of public safety bills, with several measures pulled off calendar and one consent calendar adopted. AB 2419 by Assembly Member Quirk-Silva would extend body-worn cameras to Los Angeles County juvenile probation officers. Supporters said cameras would improve accountability, youth and officer safety, and public trust; opponents argued the bill would not solve deeper problems in juvenile halls and raised concerns about officer discretion, privacy, and labor issues. The bill passed to Appropriations on a roll call vote. AB 1902 by Assembly Member Pellerin, co-sponsored by Santa Cruz County, would revise the juvenile detention extension hearing process in response to the Madison Middleton case. Supporters, including the victim’s mother and county officials, said the bill would clarify jurisdiction, allow continuances, permit hearsay at the probable cause stage, extend the maximum detention period, and better protect the public and victims from repeated trauma. Opponents from public defender, youth justice, and civil liberties groups argued the bill expands civil commitment, reduces review frequency, and could lead to inappropriate adult placement. The committee approved the bill to Appropriations, with some members noting remaining concerns. AB 2052 by Assembly Member Stephanie would allow continuity in prosecution for elder and dependent adult abuse cases, including a limited continuance so the same prosecutor can stay with a case. Supporters said older victims and those with dementia or other impairments benefit from a single point of contact and less repeated trauma; opponents said the bill could undermine speedy-trial rights and was broader than necessary. The bill passed to Judiciary. AB 1588, also by Assembly Member Stephanie, would strengthen sideshow and street takeover enforcement by adding motorcycles and dirt bikes to the law and increasing penalties. Supporters framed it as a public safety and accountability measure, while opponents warned it would expand punishment, surveillance, and fines without addressing root causes; the bill was sent to Transportation on a roll call vote. AB 1753, another Stephanie bill, would tighten firearm relinquishment and protective-order enforcement, expand remote hearing access, and align firearm prohibitions across protective order categories; it passed to Judiciary. The committee also heard AB 1739 by Assembly Member Ward, which would criminalize clergy sexual exploitation when clergy provide therapeutic services, with survivors and advocates testifying in support.

Transcript Highlights:

• This bill would place it in the state constitution. therefore complementing statute because under section
• The federal statute explicitly bans non-citizens from donating to any federal, state, or local There
• In fact, a 2023 by the Hubert Humphrey School of Public Affairs at the University of Minnesota found
• Is there objection to the adoption of the statute? Substitute on Senator Parker's motion.
• There is a statute 6 that permits voting at any early voting site. That needs to be repealed.

Bills: SB16 , SB76 , SB310 , SB311 , SB396 , SB505 , SB827 , SB964 , SB1209 , SB1210 , SB1386 , SB1470 , SB2035 , SJR37 , SB 16

Committee: Senate State Affairs

Transcript Highlights:

• I heard the story of five-year-old Liam Ramos in Minnesota, who was transported to a facility in Texas

Transcript Highlights:

• And as I sit there through the halls, I go back with guys from California and Michigan and Minnesota.

Committee: House Agricultural Affairs

Transcript Highlights:

• CHAIR, I HAVE SEEN IT IN THOSE FOUR STATES, COLORADO, WASHINGTON, MARYLAND AND I THINK IT'S MINNESOTA

Transcript Highlights:

• Dan Erman from Emanuel Lutheran School in Courtland, Minnesota.

Transcript Highlights:

• burden would be on the parent or the guardian to show a medical condition, and that would kick in the statute
• Minnesota gives 1,750 to certain kids.

Bills: H5085 , H5286

Committee: Joint Joint Committee on Children, Families and Persons with Disabilities

Keywords: poverty alleviation, family support, economic mobility, youth transition, financial education, matched savings, community programs, Department of Children and Families, DCF, child abuse investigation, child neglect, pediatrician, advanced practice registered nurse, medical misdiagnosis, rickets, Ehlers-Danlos syndrome, osteogenesis imperfecta, vitamin D deficiency, bone fragility, child welfare

Transcript Highlights:

• It was by statute that created everything.
• There were a couple of states, one of which we consulted with, Minnesota and Colorado, who established

Transcript Highlights:

• Sixteen states had very specific requirements either in statute or promulgated by the State Public Utility
• actually undertaken those initiatives, states like Colorado, as the Chair had mentioned, Illinois, Minnesota

Summary: The committee held an informational hearing on Carrier of Last Resort (COLR) to examine its history, current operation, and possible future changes in California. Chair Tasha Berner said the hearing was prompted in part by AT&T’s 2023 request for relief from COLR obligations and by broader concerns about public safety, affordability, universal service, and access to modern broadband and telecommunications. The first panel featured a telecommunications expert who traced COLR back to universal service principles and explained how states have handled COLR differently, including full deregulation, limited rural obligations, or transition pathways tied to competition and customer protections. Members asked about affordability, federal and state processes for service withdrawal, and whether COLR remains necessary given modern competition. CPUC staff then described California’s COLR framework, explaining that universal service rests on access, reliability/quality, and affordability, and that COLR requires carriers to provide basic service, including voice-grade calling, 911 access, relay services, and Lifeline. Staff said AT&T’s application sought relief in nearly all of its territory, but no replacement COLR came forward during the proceeding, and public participation hearings drew thousands of comments and strong concern from rural and vulnerable customers. The CPUC outlined its ongoing rulemaking to reconsider whether the 1996 COLR rules and 2012 basic-service definition still fit current conditions, with workshops and public hearings scheduled and a proposed decision expected later in the year or into 2026. Members pressed staff on geographic outreach, wireless coverage, whether broadband can be part of basic service, public safety during wildfires, and what reporting and complaint processes currently exist. In the final panel, industry and public-interest witnesses sharply disagreed. A U.S. Telecom representative argued COLR is outdated, costly, and copper-focused, and said reform should allow technology-neutral alternatives such as wireless, fiber, and satellite while preserving reliable voice and emergency access. The CPUC Public Advocates Office countered that COLR remains a necessary public safeguard, especially for rural and low-income customers, and argued that any transition should maintain or improve service, with public benefits such as broadband investment and continued protections for 911, disability access, and affordability. Committee members focused on the difference between an obligation to serve everyone and a mere option to serve, and on whether the Legislature should provide clearer guidance as the CPUC’s rulemaking moves forward.

Transcript Highlights:

• Generic criminal statutes without success.
• Lastly, this bill is clearly modeled on the statute at issue in Hill v. Colorado.
• I would argue, reading 5D of the statute, it's not technically an enhancement.
• I would argue reading 5D of the statute, it's not technically an enhancement.
• As a result, visitors routinely experience ...in statute and vary widely by facility.

Committee: House Public Safety

Transcript Highlights:

• So the purpose of this report is to comply with North Dakota Century Code 15.1-02-09.
• Data is submitted annually via our STARS system as required in North Dakota Century Code 15.1-02-3.
• The ND Counts pilot program—so this was an additional section of statute, kind of toward the end of the
• meet with ESPB and higher ed to talk about their standards and ensuring that they are aligning to statute
• is adjourned. and higher ed to talk about their standards and ensuring that they are aligning to statute

Committee: Joint Education Committee

Summary: The meeting focused heavily on dual credit programming across North Dakota, with presentations from Valley City State University, Lake Region State College, Fargo Public Schools, and teachers from West Fargo and Drake-Anamoose. Speakers described dual credit as a way to give high school students college-level rigor, reduce future tuition costs, and help students explore academic and career pathways. Several presenters emphasized that strong local relationships between colleges and school districts are central to program quality, especially in rural areas where access to advanced coursework can be limited. Valley City State University outlined its quality-control model, including annual teacher trainings, syllabus and outcomes alignment, faculty evaluations, qualification standards, school visits, and a goal of building 24-credit College Studies Certificates. The university reported about 504 students in the fall and 559 in the spring, with roughly 5,539 projected credit hours and about 130 students expected to earn the 24-credit certificate. Members asked about faculty qualifications, online versus in-person delivery, student retention, revenue, and whether a more centralized statewide model might be more efficient; the presenter said centralization could reduce duplication but might weaken local relationships and choice. Lake Region State College described a broader regional model, with about 913 dual credit students last fall across 44 school districts, roughly half of them taking online college courses and half taking face-to-face courses taught by qualified high school teachers serving as adjuncts. The college said it has paid for graduate credits to help teachers meet credentialing requirements and reimburses districts for teacher support and materials. Fargo Public Schools reported 50 dual credit courses through multiple higher-ed partners, 1,571 enrollments, and a 12.61% increase in participation, while also raising concerns about inconsistent registration systems, credentialing requirements, and transfer clarity across institutions. Teachers from West Fargo and Drake-Anamoose reinforced the value of dual credit, while noting concerns about retention in foundational science courses and the importance of maintaining rigor and support for students.

Transcript Highlights:

• The bill would make the necessary changes in statute, allowing the department to streamline the program
• Changes to North Dakota Administrative Code 75-02-09 were effective on January 1st this year, which formalized
• Dakota Supreme Court, the department is required to update our North Dakota Administrative Code 75-02

Summary: The committee first heard an update on North Dakota’s Interagency Council on Homelessness and Continuum of Care funding. Jennifer Henderson of the North Dakota Housing Finance Agency reported that homelessness remains driven by tight housing markets, low incomes, rising rents, and barriers to rental assistance, public benefits, and disability determinations. She said the state’s one-time North Dakota Homeless Grant is serving all regions but reaches far fewer households than the former Rent Help program, and that aging homelessness, shelter staffing shortages, and limited affordable units are growing concerns. Members discussed the need for more housing supply, better coordination with Health and Human Services, landlord engagement, reentry housing, and possible continued one-time funding for the $10 million Homeless Grant and $25 million Housing Incentive Fund. Henderson also warned that federal Continuum of Care funding is uncertain, with HUD expected to issue a new notice June 1 and possible shifts away from permanent supportive housing toward transitional housing and other models. The committee then took testimony on accessibility of government services for people who are blind, visually impaired, deaf, or hard of hearing. Paul Olson of North Dakota Vision Services School for the Blind described the school’s services for infants, children, and adults, including screenings, mobility training, assistive technology, and outreach across the state. He said the agency works closely with Vocational Rehabilitation and is also involved in improving website and document accessibility, especially for PDF materials. Public testimony highlighted barriers such as inaccessible CAPTCHA systems, online forms, driver’s license requirements on job applications, and limited transportation in rural areas. A deaf resident urged broader use of video remote interpreting and video relay services, along with training so people know how to use them effectively. Finally, Kay Larson presented the final report on the child care provider licensing study. The report recommended streamlining North Dakota’s child care licensing structure into three provider types plus a preschool designation, while preserving health and safety standards and maintaining eligibility for child care assistance. The committee discussed simplifying training and qualification rules, revising ratio and group-size requirements, and adjusting age bands for infants and toddlers. The report also noted that some changes would require statutory amendments and later administrative rule changes, with a transition period likely extending through 2029. No formal votes were taken in the transcript, but the committee accepted the updates and scheduled follow-up presentations for a later meeting.

Transcript Highlights:

• that about half of the tools were being developed on the basis of data from Palo Alto, Rochester, Minnesota
• that about half of the tools were being developed on the basis of data from Palo Alto, Rochester, Minnesota

Summary: The joint informational hearing by the Assembly Health and Privacy Committees focused on generative AI in health care, with opening remarks emphasizing both the promise of improved care and the risks around privacy, bias, workforce impacts, reimbursement, and liability. Members and witnesses repeatedly stressed that AI should augment clinicians rather than replace them, and that California has a role in shaping responsible adoption. The first panel featured health systems and developers describing current uses such as ambient scribes for physicians and nurses, imaging triage, maternal-fetal risk prediction, and administrative automation. Speakers from Cedars-Sinai, Kaiser Permanente, Penguin AI, and Google highlighted efficiency gains, reduced clinician burnout, faster treatment, and some reported patient-safety benefits, while also noting the need for human review, governance, and ongoing monitoring. Committee members pressed the panel on bias, especially for multilingual patients, women of color, and Medi-Cal populations, and on whether predictive tools could worsen disparities or drive unnecessary interventions such as C-sections. Witnesses said tools must be tested in real-world settings, with humans in the loop and outcomes tracked by demographic group. They also discussed the legal landscape, with concerns that liability may fall more on hospitals and physicians than on developers, and that clearer rules may be needed for clinical, clinical-adjacent, and administrative uses. Several speakers argued that administrative uses like prior authorization and coding are lower-risk and ripe for automation, while clinical applications require much stronger safeguards. The second panel shifted to broader policy and equity issues. The California Health Care Foundation described early AI adoption in the safety net, including a Los Angeles County homelessness-risk model and AI tools supporting community health workers, and said safety-net providers want guidance on privacy, liability, safety, bias, and workforce impacts. Dr. Ziad Obermeyer described research showing racial bias in widely used risk algorithms and argued for accountability, access to data under strong protections, public-sector leadership, and partnerships to steer AI toward better outcomes. Dr. Michelle Mello said most organizations lack strong governance, that monitoring is difficult and costly, and that states could require AI governance structures as a condition of licensure. The discussion closed with calls for clearer standards, better data access for evaluation, and policy approaches that protect patients while allowing beneficial AI to spread beyond large health systems.

Transcript Highlights:

• I'd like to offer a moment of silence for Alex Priddy, who was killed over the weekend in Minnesota.

Transcript Highlights:

• I go back every year to D.C., and I get to stand in the halls with guys from Michigan and Minnesota and

Committee: Senate Agricultural Affairs

Transcript Highlights:

• King would be in the same place he was in 2020, and that is Minneapolis, Minnesota. Dr.

Summary: The Assembly convened after an initial quorum call, then proceeded with prayer, the pledge, and routine motions. Members approved several procedural requests, including moving AB 362 to the inactive file and allowing the Natural Resources Committee to hear AB 34 on January 16. The chamber also recognized guests and paid tribute to retiring Republican caucus consultant Daryl Thomas, with remarks from multiple members praising his long service and legal analysis work. The main floor action centered on ACR 116, a resolution honoring Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Members from several caucuses and both parties spoke in support, emphasizing King’s legacy of civil rights, economic justice, nonviolence, and unfinished work. After opening the roll for coauthors, the resolution received 67 coauthors and was adopted by voice vote. The Assembly then took up ACR 118, recognizing Korean American Day; members highlighted Korean American history, community contributions, solidarity with other communities, and the significance of Koreatown and Korean American civic life. That resolution also received 67 coauthors and was adopted by voice vote. The consent calendar was then adopted on a 64-0 vote, including ACR 115 on National Blood Donor Month. The chamber also held an adjournment in memory for former legislator David Kelly, with a tribute to his military service, agricultural background, and legislative work on water conservation and sustainable agriculture. The Assembly announced the upcoming Martin Luther King Day recess and adjourned until Tuesday, January 20 at 1 p.m.

Transcript Highlights:

• acclaimed documentary series called Catholicism. by Bishop Robert Barron, now Bishop of Rochester, Minnesota

Committee: Senate Foreign Relations Committee

Keywords: legislative process, public involvement, community engagement, transparency, introductions

Summary: The meeting was characterized by a series of introductions and personal anecdotes shared by the committee members, with a focus on the importance of community engagement and transparency in legislative processes. Members expressed their commitment to open hearings and the necessity for public involvement in discussions impacting constituents. Several members remarked on how personal experiences shape their legislative priorities, thus reinforcing the human element of governance. However, there was a noticeable absence of discussion regarding specific bills, indicating that the session may have been more exploratory or introductory in nature.